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► Add to the Discussion Discussion Topic: A Few Thoughts Mitch Clark added to this discussion on February 9, 2011 Wow, thank you all for the warm welcome. I have had the ability to read most of the posts over the past month regarding the status of the Ohio State wrestling team. Here are some of my thoughts. Tom Ryan works his butt off and knows how to run a program... Lou Rosselli has forgotten more about wrestling then I ever knew. Mike P & Jaggers have had storied careers at OSU and come from the Cleveland area which is great for recruiting. Great coaching staff... My departure from the program was bitter because I saw the best man I have ever known (Russ Hellickson) get spit out and stomped on and in the years that followed his tenure he inevitably got compared to a staff that surpassed all of his accomplishments albeit mostly with his guys. Tom Ryan came in and said that he was going to "build a fence around the state of Ohio". Now Russ's strength was not his ability to recruit and he would admit it all of the time, to some degree that is a young, energetic man's game. However, it is naive to think that with an average of 2 full rides per year that you are going to keep a fence around the state of Ohio when it is probably the second most recruited state in wrestling behind Pennsylvania and at least 20 athletes per graduating class are offered D1 scholarships to schools across the country. Getting a few of the TOP wrestlers out of each senior class should be the goal. What I like about Tom is he admitted to recruiting some kids on accolades instead of on work ethic (at least that is what I gathered from his interview). OSU wrestling will be fine, I see the potential waiting in the stables. What OSU did very well right off the bat was prepare the athletes to succeed at a high level at the right time. Wheather they continue to do that remains to be seen but if they are unsuccessful at that, I am sure it will not be out of a lack of effort. Obviously being a club coach at Cornell now makes me a Big Red fan now but I enjoy following the Buckeyes from afar as well. I know I am all over the place with my thoughts but I thought I would share with you some of my thoughts from my perspective. Thanks        Discussion Topic: A Few Thoughts Roe Fox added to this discussion on February 9, 2011 ". . .the best man I have ever known (Russ Hellickson). . ." For those of us that didn't know him personally what about him made you feel this way? While it is always exciting to get a new coach like Ryan what did TOSU do that made you feel Hellickson was treated unfairly? Sometimes we forget that process counts, even if it is the process of moving from one coach to another.        Discussion Topic: A Few Thoughts Shawn Andrews added to this discussion on February 9, 2011 Mitch, you planted the idea in one of my wrestlers heads about coming up to Cornell for your team camp. Some questions 1) how long will it take to drive there 2) When is your team camp 3) cost        Discussion Topic: A Few Thoughts Mitch Clark added to this discussion on February 9, 2011 It's not that I feel that he was treated unfairly, it's that I don't think he was truely appreciated for what he had done on and off the mat at OSU. It's tough to describe Russ over a single thread other then if you knew him on a personal level, you would understand my perspective. Every time he spoke you would want to run through a wall for him. He is a great motivator, extremely ethical and honest and he had a way of simplifying the sport in the way he trained his athletes and the technique that he preached. You just wanted to be around him... maybe Rex can add his perspective on this. During his tenure he had a number of highs and lows... at the end of the day Russ is the man that I would like my son to wrestle under and I sometimes think we lose sight of that when we evaluate a D1 coach. We live in America and winning is most important so by that rationale it was time for a change. It would have been nice to see Russ go out on top which I do believe he would have been able to do with the young talent he had.        Discussion Topic: A Few Thoughts Rex Holman added to this discussion on February 9, 2011 Mitch- I think you summed up his best qualities. Great motivator, honest, he followed the rules and dedicated his life to wrestling and coaching. I know he is a father to you. Your experience in wrestling at OSU went about as well as it could. I think the ref would have been right to give you 2+2 at the end against Weldon, but I may have bias. As I look back, I get frustrated with Russ's stubborness. I hung on his every word for awhile and largely believed everthing he told me. I realize that his coaching philosophy was developed from his experience as a competitor while being coached by Terry McCann. So, to him it was gospel and he spoke it as such. Now, it is my perspective that a coach must adapt an approach to the athlete rather than the athlete conforming to a one size fits all model or a model that is constructed on one person. I think a lot of very good wrestlers get lost in the shuffle as they progress from high school to college for this very reason. This bugs me to no end.        Discussion Topic: A Few Thoughts John Fayette added to this discussion on February 9, 2011 It is a shame the packages wanted are not able to be given (in most cases not even close). In our case (as in many), I don't think it's not that they don't want to give the package needed, but they can't as Coach Ryan explained. When you look at football (and I understand they make tons of money for the school) giving 85 scholarships for 22 starters plus special teams, that is an enormous amount of money to pull good recuits in. In meeting Coach Ryan and Coach Heskett they are class acts along with being great role models. I wish OSU the best and hope they have a lot of success. I watched Vaughn wrestle last night as well as saw many kids on the bench we know and wish the best for them. The good thing is as Coach Clark said, there are others to help find a fit of what's best, and being from Ohio gives you opportunities becasue of our great reputation as a wrestling state. That makes for competition to get our Ohio guys and competition is a good thing. I think wrestling gives kids the opportunity to not only go to the next level if you can find the right fit, but more importantly help reach life goals. For that I am truly appreciative.        Discussion Topic: A Few Thoughts Lou Demas added to this discussion on February 9, 2011 When I first got out how here from Calf. I took Josh to the Ohio St. Camps wrestling camps, I can still remember telling Josh to go over watch what Mitch was doing every time he showed some scrambling in between sessions. You can still see Mitch's influence on Josh's wrestling to this day. It was great back then,all the guys treated Josh like a little brother and Russ was at the Helm. I remember listening to Russ speak to the kids at the camps during his opening speech and also a his technique sessions. The talks where not just about being a better wrestler but more importantly about being a better man and thats would was most important to me. When Russ lost his job I was truly upset. The next time I ran into Russ, I think was at one of Mitch's camps I took Josh to, I told Russ that if someone could predict the future and told me Josh may only AA once wrestling under him but one be a four time NCAA Champ if he wrestled for an other school and the only catch would be his morals and ethics suffer it would not be choice for me I would pick him. Mitch, you said it right, winning is the rationale of the day, that's what decision's are based on now. Russ brought far more important things to the table. Now, I do believe Russ had that technical know how to teach Josh to be as successful as he could at the college level but if you are father who wants what truly best for your son you would have wanted Russ as his coach even if he did not have the technical know how. You see,even if one my son would become a 4 time NCAA champ, that to will become the past. When he is old it is not important to me that anyone remember his accolades of who he was, what's most important will be, who is he? Is he a good man, is he honest, does he have integrity, does he care for all around him! I would want my son to be thought as of, as people think of Russ. Mitch, glad your on board, look forward to reading your post in future. Most of all thanks for always helping Josh even when you knew he would not attend Cornell you never stop helping him become a better wrestler and more importantly a better person.        Discussion Topic: A Few Thoughts Roe Fox added to this discussion on February 9, 2011 "Now, it is my perspective that a coach must adapt an approach to the athlete rather than the athlete conforming to a one size fits all model or a model that is constructed on one person." i think this is really interesting because I believe the two best programs (historically speaking) do it two different ways. Iowa does it the "Gable way" -- or now at least it pretends to. Bludgeon the opponent wih stamina, strength and technique. Okla. St. seems more like what Rex is talking about. Smith takes the best guys he can get and improves on what they do best. Every interview I have ever seen of Hellickson has shwon him to be a class guy. Thanks for the responses on this topic.        Discussion Topic: A Few Thoughts Justin Hayes added to this discussion on February 9, 2011 Quote from Roe Fox's post: ""Now, it is my perspective that a coach must adapt an approach to the athlete rather than the athlete conforming to a one size fits all model or a model that is constructed on one person." I think this is really interesting because I believe the two best programs (historically speaking) do it two different ways. Iowa does it the "Gable way" -- or now at least it pretends to. Bludgeon the opponent wih stamina, strength and technique. Okla. St. seems more like what Rex is talking about. Smith takes the best guys he can get and improves on what they do best. Every interview I have ever seen of Hellickson has shwon him to be a class guy. Thanks for the responses on this topic." http://ray.brinzer.net/iowa-and-oklahoma-state-a-comparison/        Discussion Topic: A Few Thoughts Mark Niemann added to this discussion on February 10, 2011 That was an AMAZING read!!! Quote: "There is a basic difference in training I observed, one which I believe gets at the very heart of the teams’ outlooks. At toOSU, if something’s not working, you try something different. At Iowa, if something’s not working, you do it harder." Great observation.        Discussion Topic: A Few Thoughts Lou Demas added to this discussion on February 11, 2011 I have a Dvd of Dan Gable's, Tricks of The Trade. Coach Gable talked on how some of his wrestler's did not do things his way but they were successful in doing what they were doing and he let them just keep doing it. I do believe there is a overriding Iowa philosophy in which Ray describes so well, yet there also seem to be by Coach Gable's own statements some flexibility with individual wrestler's in finding there own style if it was working. I think this is what many of the best coaches do. I had never see Russ teach any scrambling at any of sessions at his camps yet, Mitch wrestled under Russ came away with a unique style funk that he is highly sought after to this day. Coaches can get it right with some athlete's and get it wrong with other's. I am pretty sure some Coach Gable's past wrestler's had the best experience of there life with him while other's may have felt they were push in the wrong direction and it hurt there progression as a wrestler. The good or bad experience may also only be a matter of degree's, everyone is different. The good news for todays wrestler's is that there so much more information to help them make an educated decision about which program might be best for them, there style and wrestling philosophy.        ► Add to the Discussion