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Discussion Topic: Dear Lee Kemp
Mark Niemann added to this discussion on February 17, 2010
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Quote from Ben Golden's post:
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"
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Quote from Rex Holman's post:
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"Frustration is the birthplace of anger. Anger in the wrong context begets mistakes. "
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Mistakes like hate!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHa3D-musUw"
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That was the first thing I thought after reading Rex's post!!! But I didn't want to be the one to come off as the Star Wars nerd. Thanks for taking one for the team, Ben.
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Discussion Topic: Dear Lee Kemp
Rex Holman added to this discussion on February 17, 2010
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Ben-
Good stuff.
All of Yoda's stuff is contrived from the perspective of a Japanese Sage.
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Discussion Topic: Dear Lee Kemp
Rex Holman added to this discussion on February 17, 2010
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It is the fine line that separates being angry and level headed from angry and upset. The difference is in the discipline.
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Discussion Topic: Dear Lee Kemp
Ben Golden added to this discussion on February 17, 2010
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Quote from Mark Niemann's post:
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"
That was the first thing I thought after reading Rex's post!!! But I didn't want to be the one to come off as the Star Wars nerd. Thanks for taking one for the team, Ben."
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We can't all restrain the nerdiness, Mark!
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Discussion Topic: Dear Lee Kemp
Mark Niemann added to this discussion on February 18, 2010
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Then you need more discipline, Ben. :-D
(See Rex's above post. I'm just razzing.)
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Discussion Topic: Dear Lee Kemp
Rex Holman added to this discussion on February 18, 2010
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The dark side; interesting that you mention this with regard to Iowa as they play the bad boys who wear their emotions on their sleeves and sprint off the mat win or lose. Albeit, they win a lot.
Years ago, they had a promotional poster with Gable dressed as JR from the soap opera Dallas, and the theme was everyone loves to hate Iowa. So, even back in the late 70s early 80s, they were establishing this type of culture of we are the best and you can hate on us all you want, we will just keep on winning and you can keep on hating.
Now with regard to discipline. This is where it gets interesting as I recently did a little research and contemplated the subject.
The Law I wrote is as follows:
Law of Discipline-Discipline is the mental and physical capacity, which is acquired by developing inhibitory and self regulating response to demands. The response manages thoughts and behaviors through elective restraint or engagement with manufactured or recognized parameters. Discipline makes use of structure that serves a purpose and directs us. Discipline allows for high level functioning in any stressful, ambiguous or adverse situation where direction may be in question. Discipline enables elective restraint or engagement with regard to perception, analysis and motor specific tasks. Choices become blurred and divided lines crossed without the capacity of discipline. Mental observance is used in conjunction with the act of discipline. Mental observance with inhibition of impulsivity coordinated with high level mental functioning allows one to achieve a desired end.
I will make a statement to the effect that Iowa has highly developed discipline in terms of wrestling.
Per evolutionists, parts of the cerebral cortex are the most recent evolvement of the human brain and are responsible for high level mental functions. It is the part of the brain that houses are ability to problem solve, and use volitional constraint. These high level mental functions separates us from the rest animal kingdom. We can choose and act upon our thoughts and behavior through attendance and identification of what end we pursue. It is this constraint and self regulation that is both discipline and will.
Now with regard to sportsmanship. It is a volition which may be looked at on a continuum from important to insignificant. If you choose to engage the concept as important, then you are likely develop that quality to some degree. If not, then you are either ignoring it, view it as unimportant, allowing your lower brain to control your actions, or some combination of the three. They all actually work together as ignorance begets devaluation, which begets more animalistic tendencies.
Draw your own conclusions.
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Discussion Topic: Dear Lee Kemp
Bob Preusse added to this discussion on February 18, 2010
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Rex,
interesting comments, in that Bill Barger employed the same "us vs them, bad boyz" attitude on his great Walsh Jesuit teams of the 90s. I traveled around the country with Walsh back then to do a series of magazine articles on their rise.
around the country everyone was interested in this Walsh Jesuit phenomenon that burst on the scene back then. The dynasty didnt really last that long, barely a full decade but it was a brilliant comet in its time.
s/BobP
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Discussion Topic: Dear Lee Kemp
Mark Palumbo added to this discussion on February 18, 2010
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There is something to be said for breading a belief that your team and therefore you are better than your opponent. In tight matches it is that belief that might make the difference. Belief in your team, coaches, technique, and conditioning. I’ve said in the past Coach D from Solon does this very well at this. He tends to get a lot out of average athletes. He may use the boxing robes or other techniques to get them in this mind set. For a short time, they think they are better than everyone, almost too good for the mat. They shake hands with their opponent before and after the match, but that is it. Rarely will they shake another coaches hand after a match and frankly I have no issue with that. The other 9 months of the year these kids are very enjoyable to be around.
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Discussion Topic: Dear Lee Kemp
Gary Sommers added to this discussion on February 18, 2010
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Quote from Mark Palumbo's post:
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"There is something to be said for breading a belief that your team and therefore you are better than your opponent. In tight matches it is that belief that might make the difference. Belief in your team, coaches, technique, and conditioning. I’ve said in the past Coach D from Solon does this very well at this. He tends to get a lot out of average athletes. He may use the boxing robes or other techniques to get them in this mind set. For a short time, they think they are better than everyone, almost too good for the mat. They shake hands with their opponent before and after the match, but that is it. Rarely will they shake another coaches hand after a match and frankly I have no issue with that. The other 9 months of the year these kids are very enjoyable to be around."
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When did believing in yourself and good sportsmanship become mutually exclusive?
Maybe I am just getting too old to understand the "modern athlete". :(
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Last edited by Gary Sommers on February 18, 2010; edited 2 times in total
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Discussion Topic: Dear Lee Kemp
Rex Holman added to this discussion on February 18, 2010
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Bob-
There is no denying Walsh had a great run and produced some greats and is still producing, if not on the same scale.
Mark-
Some people say attitude is everything, but I'm with you, belief is everything. It underwrites attitude. (otherwise, how does anyone account for people blowing themselves up and others in the name of religion) Personally, I like sportsmanship and I think it needs to be a part of the equation. Each individual is unique and has to figure out what is right for themself. However, cultural conditioning is a collective belief on how someone thinks they should behave in the context of others in their group. More often than not, people will abide by the culture from which they are from.
You hit on another point that I wanted to make and that is the kids are typically reflecting what they are taught. I like Coach D's innovativeness. I am not familiar with any outright acts which offend others. I thought the dresses were silly, but were the means to keep the kids on his team loose and ready.
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Discussion Topic: Dear Lee Kemp
Bob Preusse added to this discussion on February 18, 2010
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"Bob- There is no denying Walsh had a great run and produced some greats and is still producing, if not on the same scale."
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think about this, in the mid 90s Walsh Jesuit had a few teams that i thought if they wrestled an OHIO ALL-STAR team, Walsh Jesuit would have very possibly won the dual meet.
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Discussion Topic: Dear Lee Kemp
Gary Sommers added to this discussion on February 18, 2010
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Quote from Bob Preusse's post:
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""Bob- There is no denying Walsh had a great run and produced some greats and is still producing, if not on the same scale."
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think about this, in the mid 90s Walsh Jesuit had a few teams that I thought if they wrestled an OHIO ALL-STAR team, Walsh Jesuit would have very possibly won the dual meet."
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It is probably just me, but "team" accomplishments at open enrollment schools doesn't really impress me. The individuals were clearly very good, but the collection of guys from who knows how many zip codes is another matter.
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Discussion Topic: Dear Lee Kemp
Mark Palumbo added to this discussion on February 18, 2010
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Gary,
Sportsmanship and winning are definitely not mutually exclusive. There is a ton of sportsmanship in the sport by rules themselves. Shake hands before and after. No slap hands no high fives, hand shakes only. I myself was never a fan of shaking the hand of two coaches and a trainer in the other corner and I don't think anyone how knows me would say I was a bad sport. You need to draw a line some place.
In a dual meet or finals you may have to shake hands at the intro as well. So that is three time. Where do you draw the line? Stat girls, parents, friends and relatives? I’ve seen to often a kid get the crap kicked out of him or kick the crap out of someone and he goes to the other coach to shake and the other coach is busy talking (coaching) to either the kid that just came off the mat or the next one up. so it becomes meaningless.
My point is win or lose you must be a good sport, but the coach can set his team apart and make them believe in themselves buy doing little things within the rules to give his kid an advantage. Isn’t that part of his job? Put your kid in the best possible position to win. So Gable having his kids run on and off the mat (workman like), or the Solon kids not shaking every hand in the world (but staying within the rules) is not necessarily bad sportsman ship, it is just looking for an advantage much like sleeping right and/or eating correctly, just trying to win. It is funny coach D is a much different guy over the summer when he let's everyone and anyone in his gym for open mats and will help out in any way he can. I think he is just trying to be a successful as possible. and for the most part he has good kids wrestling for him from good families.
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