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Discussion Topic: David Taylor Documentary
Gary Sommers added to this discussion on September 19, 2009
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Quote from Ben Golden's post:
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Quote from Gary Sommers's post:
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Quote from Ben Golden's post:
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"Since he's been out of HS, I've thought LeBron has been extraordinarily down to earth for the star he is.
You sound like a bitter old man criticizing whether or not he gives enough back. Who are you to judge that? I bet he's given a lot more than you, and certainly mountains more than me.
Also, in one post you bash him, and in the next you say that "he has just done what you are supposed to do." I don't think LeBron would disagree with you here, and what's your point? He should be chided for not exceeding your expectations for functioning in society?
The truth is, LeBron probably received more hype and media attention at a younger than any other athlete out there. Many people would be complete egomaniacs with that type of attention. LeBron is not."
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Ben, I am not judging anything at all. I am just not quite so quick to praise hiim when I don't know the complete circumstances. If that makes me a "bitter old man", so be it. But to be honest with you, age insults are pretty weak.
By the way, yea he is pretty much a complete egomaniac. "King James" embroidered on the seats of his Hummer? "Chosen 1" tattoed on his back? "LBJ MVP" shirt in public? Uh sure, nothing egocentric about those. Now, if you want ot excuse or defend those have at it. But to ignore or deny them is kind of silly."
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The Hummer and tats were in High School. If you'll read my post, I said "Since he's been out of HS, I've thought LeBron has been extraordinarily down to earth for the star he is."
Even LeBron has said the Hummer with the embroidered seats was overboard."
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Sorry, I didn't know life begins after high school. And what about the LBJ MVP t-shirt? No ego there huh?
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Discussion Topic: David Taylor Documentary
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on September 19, 2009
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I told myself I wasn't going to post on this topic, but here it goes. Mr. Sommers, only you could watch that video and somehow draw a line between David Taylor and Terrell Owens. If I'm correct, our last discussion began with a topic about where David Taylor might choose to go to school. Hmm, are you sure you just don't have some issue with David Taylor? It seems nothing he does is good enough for you. Four State titles, four Ironman titles, Fargo titles in both styles, bumping up for the challenge of wrestling Palmer, the Dave Schultz Award (with a classy speech to boot), 3.8 GPA, and by all accounts a good kid. What could he have done differently to be worthy of praise or is it just that no 18-year-old deserves it, period?
Anyway, moving on to LeBron:
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Quote from Gary Sommers's post:
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"Ben, I am not judging anything at all. I am just not quite so quick to praise hiim when I don't know the complete circumstances. If that makes me a "bitter old man", so be it. But to be honest with you, age insults are pretty weak.
By the way, yea he is pretty much a complete egomaniac. "King James" embroidered on the seats of his Hummer? "Chosen 1" tattoed on his back? "LBJ MVP" shirt in public? Uh sure, nothing egocentric about those. Now, if you want ot excuse or defend those have at it. But to ignore or deny them is kind of silly."
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I'm not a big LeBron fan (I don't have anything against him, but I just don't watch a lot of basketball), but you say "I am just not quite so quick to praise hiim when I don't know the complete circumstances", which I have no problem with. But then you come back with "By the way, yea he is pretty much a complete egomaniac. "King James" embroidered on the seats of his Hummer? "Chosen 1" tattoed on his back? "LBJ MVP" shirt in public? Uh sure, nothing egocentric about those". Do you feel like you have the "complete circumstance" surrounding those? And if so, how? Do you know him personally? It would seem to me if you don't know him well enough to praise him, then you don't know him well enough to condemn him.
Also, "age insults are pretty weak"? Are you serious? You have said time and time again that everyone younger than you has no honor or morals. It shouldn't shock anyone that you don't think LeBron (or David Taylor, for that matter) is worthy of praise...they're just to young to measure up to your 1980s standard. Of course the 1980s are known for their honesty and integrity.
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Discussion Topic: David Taylor Documentary
Gary Sommers added to this discussion on September 19, 2009
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Quote from Michael Rodriguez's post:
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"I told myself I wasn't going to post on this topic, but here it goes. Mr. Sommers, only you could watch that video and somehow draw a line between David Taylor and Terrell Owens. If I'm correct, our last discussion began with a topic about where David Taylor might choose to go to school. Hmm, are you sure you just don't have some issue with David Taylor? It seems nothing he does is good enough for you. Four State titles, four Ironman titles, Fargo titles in both styles, bumping up for the challenge of wrestling Palmer, the Dave Schultz Award (with a classy speech to boot), 3.8 GPA, and by all accounts a good kid. What could he have done differently to be worthy of praise or is it just that no 18-year-old deserves it, period?
Anyway, moving on to LeBron:
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Quote from Gary Sommers's post:
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"Ben, I am not judging anything at all. I am just not quite so quick to praise hiim when I don't know the complete circumstances. If that makes me a "bitter old man", so be it. But to be honest with you, age insults are pretty weak.
By the way, yea he is pretty much a complete egomaniac. "King James" embroidered on the seats of his Hummer? "Chosen 1" tattoed on his back? "LBJ MVP" shirt in public? Uh sure, nothing egocentric about those. Now, if you want ot excuse or defend those have at it. But to ignore or deny them is kind of silly."
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I'm not a big LeBron fan (I don't have anything against him, but I just don't watch a lot of basketball), but you say "I am just not quite so quick to praise hiim when I don't know the complete circumstances", which I have no problem with. But then you come back with "By the way, yea he is pretty much a complete egomaniac. "King James" embroidered on the seats of his Hummer? "Chosen 1" tattoed on his back? "LBJ MVP" shirt in public? Uh sure, nothing egocentric about those". Do you feel like you have the "complete circumstance" surrounding those? And if so, how? Do you know him personally? It would seem to me if you don't know him well enough to praise him, then you don't know him well enough to condemn him.
Also, "age insults are pretty weak"? Are you serious? You have said time and time again that everyone younger than you has no honor or morals. It shouldn't shock anyone that you don't think LeBron (or David Taylor, for that matter) is worthy of praise...they're just to young to measure up to your 1980s standard. Of course the 1980s are known for their honesty and integrity."
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I have never said Taylor is not worthy of praise. I just thought a documentary might be going a bit too far too fast. That was it.
As far as James, I DON'T know whose pockets his "contributions" come out of. I DO know whose Hummer had King James, whose back has Chosen 1, and whose upper body was wearing LBJ MVP.
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Discussion Topic: David Taylor Documentary
Michael Rodriguez added to this discussion on September 19, 2009
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Mr. Sommers, don't you see how you look for the absolute worst possible way to view these people? There's nothing wrong with the Taylor video, as you admit, but you feel compelled to point out how it often leads to the inflated egos. You choose to see the negitive, even when it's simply not there. Rather then say, "congratualtions Mr. Taylor on a fine high school career, and good luck at the next level". You say "stuff like this is what seems to often lead to the inflated egos (see T.O, Chad Johnson, LeBron James, and on and on) and associated problems with many athletes today."
When LeBron gives to charity, you question the origin of his contributions rather then saying thanks for giving. When an 18-year-old who has been given the World writes some cocky stuff on the seats of his car or gets a tatoo that you don't think is appropriate, you could chalk it up to maturity (or lack thereof) and not lump him into a catergory of all that is wrong with big-time sports today. But you don't.
Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. All you do is throw rocks. You portray yourself as a person of unimpeachable integrity, who grew up in a different time, when society played by differnt rules. Well, the times aren't that different. The rules are basically the same. And I suspect the flawless integrity you assign to yourself is as false as your claims that the 1980s were a time when a strict moral code ruled the land.
And, I notice you didn't respond to the "age insults are pretty weak" comment.
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Last edited by Michael Rodriguez on September 21, 2009; edited 1 time in total
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Discussion Topic: David Taylor Documentary
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on September 20, 2009
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Gary: I think Mike is on to something.
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Discussion Topic: David Taylor Documentary
Chris Shepherd added to this discussion on September 20, 2009
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Back on topic here...
Good luck to David. I'm sure he'll represent our state as well as any kid possibly could in the years ahead.
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Discussion Topic: David Taylor Documentary
Roe Fox added to this discussion on September 21, 2009
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Wow, glad I enjoyed my weekend instead of reading Gary's blather. I agree with your moral stands often but your comments on Lebron belie a very big ignorance of the reality of today's society. Thanks to steve, Mike, etc. for making some very good points.
Who has LeBron made better? I wasn't referring to sports, I mean life. There isw a whole group of guys he went to H.S. with whom he employs, leads by example, keeps out of trouble. Reality? How many of those guys (I know Gary you'll call it a posse) would be running the streets or in prison without his help?
We watch sprots for several reasons. We like to see the under-talented over achieve, the hard worker get rewarded, and with a very select few like LeBron and David Tayor, marvel at their specail gift. Some waste it; these two haven't. . .yet.
Would it be nice if LeBron married his baby momma. Of course. What he hasn't done is go from woman to woman, have multiple children with them, then leave them ala Shawn Kemp or Evander Holyfield.
Society has a lot of problems caused by a lot of things like the old welfare state, lack of discipline at home, lack of parental involvement, etc. LeBron has made it despite a lot of obstacles. It is tuly jaded to, in any serious way, critique how LeBron has used his talent to make himself and others a better life.
My last comment. Gary, as we know, you will have the very last one.
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Discussion Topic: David Taylor Documentary
Gary Sommers added to this discussion on September 25, 2009
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Quote from Roe Fox's post:
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"Wow, glad I enjoyed my weekend instead of reading Gary's blather. I agree with your moral stands often but your comments on Lebron belie a very big ignorance of the reality of today's society. Thanks to steve, Mike, etc. for making some very good points.
Who has LeBron made better? I wasn't referring to sports, I mean life. There isw a whole group of guys he went to H.S. with whom he employs, leads by example, keeps out of trouble. Reality? How many of those guys (I know Gary you'll call it a posse) would be running the streets or in prison without his help?
We watch sprots for several reasons. We like to see the under-talented over achieve, the hard worker get rewarded, and with a very select few like LeBron and David Tayor, marvel at their specail gift. Some waste it; these two haven't. . .yet.
Would it be nice if LeBron married his baby momma. Of course. What he hasn't done is go from woman to woman, have multiple children with them, then leave them ala Shawn Kemp or Evander Holyfield.
Society has a lot of problems caused by a lot of things like the old welfare state, lack of discipline at home, lack of parental involvement, etc. LeBron has made it despite a lot of obstacles. It is tuly jaded to, in any serious way, critique how LeBron has used his talent to make himself and others a better life.
My last comment. Gary, as we know, you will have the very last one."
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I haven't posted in this thread in DAYS, but since you insist.
I did not make up the word "posse", or use it in this context, so why that comment?
The reality of today's society? Can we keep that comment limited to a sect of society? The one my family lives in is quite different, and I dare say better.
"Baby momma"? You've got to be kidding me with that asinine phrase. I have read you on here often, and I know you are better than to use that ridiculous line. Please tell me that was said with your tongue DEEPLY in your cheek. And being better than Kemp is now the gold standard of fatherhood?
Yes, he has made it, but truthfully his largest obstacle was his mother. Who put him in those situations besides her?
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Discussion Topic: David Taylor Documentary
Pat Costilow added to this discussion on September 26, 2009
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This has gotten far too off topic.
As far as the documentary goes, I felt it was well done.
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Discussion Topic: David Taylor Documentary
Greg Debbe added to this discussion on September 26, 2009
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Yes, the documentary was awesome.
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