|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Discussion Topic: Cael Sanderson is the new head coach at Penn State
Al McIntosh added to this discussion on April 18, 2009
|
I need to keep up on the latest in wrestling news. I was in shock this morning when I read about Cael Sanderson leaving ISU for PSU. On some other forums I read that he was offered something like 2.5 million over 5 years. When you consider Jim Tressel makes 2.5 million per year coaching football, and Thad Madda makes 1.2 million per year coaching basketball, then I guess 500k per year is not that big of a deal. However I tend to believe that salary is for the simple reason that Cael Sanderson was an insitution at ISU as an Olympic gold medalist with the 159-0 college career. Through the Asics shoe deal, camps, and other local endorsements, he was probably making over 500k per year anyway. The local endorsements go out the window. His shoe deal shouldn't suffer, but the entire image of ISU wrestling might.
As far as Ohioians David Taylor and Jamie Clark go, it appears that subject has been completely covered. My guess is that ISU will do the right thing and release Taylor from his NLI, but I think they will do so only after hiring and getting direction from their new coach. Why would they get rid of their entire recruiting class without giving the new coach a chance to establish a relationship with them? Thus, I've got to think Joe Heskett is on the short list as the next head coach for ISU. I'm not sure if Joe even wants the job or will apply, however I have to think that Joe has somewhat of a relationship with David Taylor since they are both from Ohio. Jamie Clark can go anywhere he wants to as he has not signed an NLI.
If David is offered a release he may still honor his NLI if Heskett is hired as the head coach. The situation kind of reminds me of when Lance Palmer signed his NLI while Russ Hellickson was head coach. One of the first things Tom Ryan did when he got the job at OSU was reach out to Lance Palmer. I truly believe OSU would have released Lance if he had requested it. Ryan essentially had to recruit Palmer all over again.
So let me get this straight, as far as major college openings we have: 1. Iowa State, 2. Illinois, 3. Arizona State... That's unbelievable.
|
|
|
|
|
Discussion Topic: Cael Sanderson is the new head coach at Penn State
Brian Morrow added to this discussion on April 18, 2009
|
I am a Buckeye all the way but I believe this is good for wrestling. Maybe I am wrong; if so, fill me in as to why. I think Tom Ryan is still the man here. I believe he still will get the guys he needs to keep us toward the top. I mean he has Logan Stieber coming in who is probably the top recruit next year. We all know his brother is going to follow him. I just hope that those two coming keeps Chris Phillips here. From what I hear Paddock is the real deal also.
|
|
|
|
|
Discussion Topic: Cael Sanderson is the new head coach at Penn State
Todd Vennis added to this discussion on April 18, 2009
|
I would say that Sanderson poses more of a threat to the Lehigh's, Edinboros, Clarions, Pitts, etc that are Div. I schools in PA.than it is to OSU. If PSU is now able to hoard the majority of talent in the Keystone state and weaken those traditionally strong programs, it might be a bad development for wrestling in general as those programs may fall victim to the axe. Or it could trickle down as those programs take kids who normally would go to the Pitt-Johnstowns, Gannons, Mercyhursts, of the world.
|
|
|
|
|
Discussion Topic: Cael Sanderson is the new head coach at Penn State
Gary Sommers added to this discussion on April 18, 2009
|
|
Quote from Al McIntosh's post:
|
|
"I need to keep up on the latest in wrestling news. I was in shock this morning when I read about Cael Sanderson leaving ISU for PSU. On some other forums I read that he was offered something like 2.5 million over 5 years. When you consider Jim Tressel makes 2.5 million per year coaching football, and Thad Madda makes 1.2 million per year coaching basketball, then I guess 500k per year is not that big of a deal. However I tend to believe that salary is for the simple reason that Cael Sanderson was an insitution at ISU as an Olympic gold medalist with the 159-0 college career. Through the Asics shoe deal, camps, and other local endorsements, he was probably making over 500k per year anyway. The local endorsements go out the window. His shoe deal shouldn't suffer, but the entire image of ISU wrestling might.
As far as Ohioians David Taylor and Jamie Clark go, it appears that subject has been completely covered. My guess is that ISU will do the right thing and release Taylor from his NLI, but I think they will do so only after hiring and getting direction from their new coach. Why would they get rid of their entire recruiting class without giving the new coach a chance to establish a relationship with them? Thus, I've got to think Joe Heskett is on the short list as the next head coach for ISU. I'm not sure if Joe even wants the job or will apply, however I have to think that Joe has somewhat of a relationship with David Taylor since they are both from Ohio. Jamie Clark can go anywhere he wants to as he has not signed an NLI.
If David is offered a release he may still honor his NLI if Heskett is hired as the head coach. The situation kind of reminds me of when Lance Palmer signed his NLI while Russ Hellickson was head coach. One of the first things Tom Ryan did when he got the job at OSU was reach out to Lance Palmer. I truly believe OSU would have released Lance if he had requested it. Ryan essentially had to recruit Palmer all over again.
So let me get this straight, as far as major college openings we have: 1. Iowa State, 2. Illinois, 3. Arizona State... That's unbelievable."
|
Unless Sanderson broke his contract why is releasing anyone the "right thing"? The LOI is with the SCHOOL, NOT the coach. The school is still there and willing to have him, so they have done nothing wrong to owe him anything.
|
|
|
|
|
Discussion Topic: Cael Sanderson is the new head coach at Penn State
Scott Shaw added to this discussion on April 20, 2009
|
Gary, that is the same argument that people make everytime one of these situations comes up. You are entitled to your opinion, but in my opinion, that is nonsense.
Taylor stated very clearly when he signed at ISU that it was to go there and wrestle for his ultimate role model, his hero in the sport of wrestling. He chose Iowa State because of Cael Sanderson, period. He chose Cael Sanderson first, Iowa State second. When Tom Ryan came to Ohio State and the coaches were making their tour to introduce themselves to the state, I asked Joe Heskett why he decided to leave Ohio and why he was coming back. Not once did he say that it had anything to do with academics and Joe was an excellent student. He left because he didn't feel that he could win a championship at Ohio State, plain and simple. Now he is back because he wanted to help right that wrong for the Ohio kids.
80-85% of college majors can be chosen at any of the top programs so it comes down to which wrestling program you feel is a better fit. While academics and school community are factors, they are secondary factors to most kids that are seeking degrees that they can get at nearly all of the top schools. Unless a kid is looking for a specific degree that is limiting his school choices to a couple of schools, academics will come after the program for these athletes.
You can't use the recruiting money that they spent on him as a reason to MAKE him come because they would have spent that money anyway and there was no guarantee that he was coming. He is arguably the top recruit in the country and Iowa State would have been spending that money all along. As it is, it worked for them, but that is because of the coach. Now the coach is gone, so shouldn't the high school kid still change his mind and go where he wants.
I ramble, but the "school didn't do anything to him" argument is IN MY OPINION (again, you are entitled to yours) a bad argument and a premature one, maybe Taylor still goes to Iowa State because they hire a coach that he is confident in.
|
|
|
|
|
Discussion Topic: Cael Sanderson is the new head coach at Penn State
Gary Sommers added to this discussion on April 20, 2009
|
|
Quote from Scott Shaw's post:
|
|
"Gary, that is the same argument that people make everytime one of these situations comes up. You are entitled to your opinion, but in my opinion, that is nonsense.
Taylor stated very clearly when he signed at ISU that it was to go there and wrestle for his ultimate role model, his hero in the sport of wrestling. He chose Iowa State because of Cael Sanderson, period. He chose Cael Sanderson first, Iowa State second. When Tom Ryan came to Ohio State and the coaches were making their tour to introduce themselves to the state, I asked Joe Heskett why he decided to leave Ohio and why he was coming back. Not once did he say that it had anything to do with academics and Joe was an excellent student. He left because he didn't feel that he could win a championship at Ohio State, plain and simple. Now he is back because he wanted to help right that wrong for the Ohio kids.
80-85% of college majors can be chosen at any of the top programs so it comes down to which wrestling program you feel is a better fit. While academics and school community are factors, they are secondary factors to most kids that are seeking degrees that they can get at nearly all of the top schools. Unless a kid is looking for a specific degree that is limiting his school choices to a couple of schools, academics will come after the program for these athletes.
You can't use the recruiting money that they spent on him as a reason to MAKE him come because they would have spent that money anyway and there was no guarantee that he was coming. He is arguably the top recruit in the country and Iowa State would have been spending that money all along. As it is, it worked for them, but that is because of the coach. Now the coach is gone, so shouldn't the high school kid still change his mind and go where he wants.
I ramble, but the "school didn't do anything to him" argument is IN MY OPINION (again, you are entitled to yours) a bad argument and a premature one, maybe Taylor still goes to Iowa State because they hire a coach that he is confident in."
|
I understand what you are saying, but the truth is he signed with Iowa State University, NOT Cael Sanderson. My guess is Sanderson's name does not appear anywhere in the NLI he signed.
I wonder, if Sanderson was the sole reason he signed with ISU, if and how much he asked him if he was planning on staying his entire 4 or 5 years. If that was my main (only) reason for attending the school I sure would have, or his parents sure should have. Yes Sanderson could have lied, but at least they would have known that they did their part to find out.
|
|
|
|
|
Discussion Topic: Cael Sanderson is the new head coach at Penn State
Scott Shaw added to this discussion on April 20, 2009
|
|
|
|
Discussion Topic: Cael Sanderson is the new head coach at Penn State
Gary Sommers added to this discussion on April 20, 2009
|
So much for everyone on here using the "he set himself, his kids, and his grandkids up for life" excuse.
|
|
|
|
|
Discussion Topic: Cael Sanderson is the new head coach at Penn State
Scott Shaw added to this discussion on April 20, 2009
|
"Lied" is a strong word. I don't think that if asked in November that Sanderson would have HONESTLY even thought about leaving ISU. I don't think that many jobs would have lured him from Iowa State. Maybe Okie State, Ohio State, and Penn State. As none of those jobs were open in November and Penn State was considered to be a threat this season, it wasn't until they underperformed that the PSU job opened up. So "lied" is probably not the best choice of words.
Yes, I am biased in my opinion of Cael Sanderson (my son's name is Cael because of Sanderson.) I think that in a day of extremely poor athletic role models, he is a shining star. I will probably never see anything wrong in what he has chosen to do or will do in the future. That is me, but he hasn't given me reason to think differently yet. So I don't think that he has lied to anyone or will lie to anyone. He has already gotten hate mail directed towards his family so I don't think that he took this decision lightly.
GOOD LUCK CAEL!!! And unfortunately, watch out to the rest of the country.
(I still think that Ohio State has the best coaching staff in the country, they will just have to work that much hard that is all.)
|
|
|
|
|
Discussion Topic: Cael Sanderson is the new head coach at Penn State
Gary Sommers added to this discussion on April 20, 2009
|
|
Quote from Scott Shaw's post:
|
|
""Lied" is a strong word. I don't think that if asked in November that Sanderson would have HONESTLY even thought about leaving ISU. I don't think that many jobs would have lured him from Iowa State. Maybe Okie State, Ohio State, and Penn State. As none of those jobs were open in November and Penn State was considered to be a threat this season, it wasn't until they underperformed that the PSU job opened up. So "lied" is probably not the best choice of words.
Yes, I am biased in my opinion of Cael Sanderson (my son's name is Cael because of Sanderson.) I think that in a day of extremely poor athletic role models, he is a shining star. I will probably never see anything wrong in what he has chosen to do or will do in the future. That is me, but he hasn't given me reason to think differently yet. So I don't think that he has lied to anyone or will lie to anyone. He has already gotten hate mail directed towards his family so I don't think that he took this decision lightly.
GOOD LUCK CAEL!!! And unfortunately, watch out to the rest of the country.
(I still think that Ohio State has the best coaching staff in the country, they will just have to work that much hard that is all.)"
|
If he did, and I don't know, break his contract and hence his word that would not be enough reason for you to temper your hero-worshipping?
|
|
|
|
|
Discussion Topic: Cael Sanderson is the new head coach at Penn State
Scott Shaw added to this discussion on April 20, 2009
|
After reading the statement by the ISU AD...
http://www.themat.com/section.php?section_id=3&page=showarticle&ArticleID=20165
...it sounds as if ISU pulled out all of the stops to keep him in Ames. I don't think that they would have done that for somebody that broke his contract. He decided to leave for the reasons that he said, ISU respects him for that and wish him the best.
This situation is different than the Brands to VTech to Iowa situation. That whole thing was ugly and handled wrong by all parties involved. I lost respect for Tom Brands in those days and he hasn't done anything to change my opinion back. Sanderson, Penn State, and Iowa State seem to be handling all of this much better. Here is to hoping that they continue to do so and that would especially include, treating the athletes involved (including the recruits) like human beings and not marketing tools or martyrs to make a statement about this or that being wrong with the system.
But to answer your question directly...My heroworship runs pretty deep, but it in today's day and age, it wouldn't take much for me to become disenchanted with anybody short of my wife.
|
|
|
|
|
Discussion Topic: Cael Sanderson is the new head coach at Penn State
Hank Kornblut added to this discussion on April 20, 2009
|
After reading Cael's statement, I think he spoke honestly. He wants to coach in the best possible situation to win NCAA titles and believes PSU offers a better chance to make that happen. In other words, it's a career move.
I don't think he can recruit any better at PSU than he did at ISU. We'll see.
It will be interesting to see how many current ISU wrestlers try to follow him.
It'll also be interesting to see what happens with Taylor and Clark.
One last comment--College coaches such as Tom Ryan and Cael Sanderson have clearly changed the balance of power in college wrestling by re-locating in states that have the most talent. We're going to see some intense recruiting wars in the future. It appears that Ohio State and PSU will represent one mighty sphere while Okie State and Iowa will form the other.
|
|
|
|
|
Discussion Topic: Cael Sanderson is the new head coach at Penn State
Gary Sommers added to this discussion on April 20, 2009
|
|
Quote from Scott Shaw's post:
|
|
"After reading the statement by the ISU AD...
http://www.themat.com/section.php?section_id=3&page=showarticle&ArticleID=20165
...it sounds as if ISU pulled out all of the stops to keep him in Ames. I don't think that they would have done that for somebody that broke his contract. He decided to leave for the reasons that he said, ISU respects him for that and wish him the best.
This situation is different than the Brands to VTech to Iowa situation. That whole thing was ugly and handled wrong by all parties involved. I lost respect for Tom Brands in those days and he hasn't done anything to change my opinion back. Sanderson, Penn State, and Iowa State seem to be handling all of this much better. Here is to hoping that they continue to do so and that would especially include, treating the athletes involved (including the recruits) like human beings and not marketing tools or martyrs to make a statement about this or that being wrong with the system.
But to answer your question directly...My heroworship runs pretty deep, but it in today's day and age, it wouldn't take much for me to become disenchanted with anybody short of my wife."
|
Glad to see you say that about your wife. :)
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
